Buying maneuvers for strategy and tactics

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  • Buying maneuvers for strategy and tactics

    Okay lets consider this, it's sometimes worth your while to spend some extra character points to DO THIS: purchase a whole martial-stlye just to learn one maneuver. The cost is only two points for the style and how ever many points the maneuver you want costs. Usually two points. So about four points. you start off with a cool martial style like Demon storm then you have your character learn the:

    'Balance Stance' maneuver from the Kratellah Style or the
    'Capering Bandar' maneuver from The Way of Muhibh or the
    'Spinning Feather' maneuver of Kirah's Fury or the
    'Vigorous Judgement' or 'Warrior's Will' maneuvers from the Undying Warrior Style or the
    'Hail and Mist' from the Wind in Mist Style or the
    'Still the Beetle's Limb' or 'Spider Bites his Prey' attacks from the Devah's Chosen Style or the
    'Dance of the Motionless' technique from the Spiral Dancer style or the
    'Raging Janah' maneuver of the Gajah Style ( my favorite! ) or the
    'Dancing Path' maneuver of Raska's Chain ( the absolute best technique! )

    and then combine it with the 'passing the dead' or 'blossom cut' maneuver to gain a terrible advantage over your enemies that will have your gamemaster looking for exciting new ways to make your character suffer for being such a super-ninja-badass.

    Along the same line of thinking, one could design a fighting sir'hibas character with this concept: High Agility and Hiigh Essence, then buy the Shard Storm and Archer's Way Styles and just the 'Leap of Faith' and 'Balance of the Duhama' maneuvers from the Heaven's Sword Style and PRESTO! You have the impossible-to-close-in-on sorcerer who is a "distance weapon master" that the party will quickly come to respect. Those two martial styles ( Shard Storm and Archer's Way ) together are unholy and heinous. The shocking quickness with which you will jazzerslay even the toughest opponents will wow onlookers and dismay your gamemaster.
    "Daggra" means "Enemy" in Tibetan.
    "Chora" means "Thief" in Sanskrit.
  • RE: Buying maneuvers for strategy and tactics

    The only problem I see with this (and I believe it states this in the chapter pertaining to martial arts in the Magic and Martial Arts book) is,..read and weep,...you can use only one Martial Style per round. You can "mix and match" Styles throughout an entire combat, but you cannot "mix and match" separate Styles within the same 6-second round.. Them's the rules.....

    The only pseudo exception is that you MAY use the basic Martial Maneuvers (on the back of the character sheet,..and in the Basic Compendium) at any time throughout any round, along with any specific single Martial Style you may be using that round. But again,..you MAY NOT use a maneuver from one Style,..then instantly switch to the physical and spiritual methodologies painstakingly developed for a different Martial Style maneuver in the same round of combat.

    The closest you could get to achieving that would be to plan the move you want to come at the end of one round, then hope to continue the chain as you plan the move from another Style at the very beginning of the next round....

    Sorry dudes...

    Scottie ^^
  • That Rule should be changed

    Okay, let me cite several martial artists, touting the benefits of not only learning several martial arts styles as they have done, but how in-so-doing, you expand and improve your own advancement as a martial artist.

    "The concept of Mixed Martial Arts is based on the fact that every Martial Art has some weak points to it, regardless of how old or "powerful" they claim to be. Mixing them covers for those weak points by supplementing in strengths from other styles." - JM Ken Barthle From This Page

    "The idea of using multiple martial arts styles for competition is not a new concept; the Greeks introduced the sport of Pankration (Pan, meaning "all", Kratos, meaning "powers") in 648 B.C.E., and Bruce Lee promoted the utilization of multiple techniques as well." - Daniele, Bolelli From This Page

    "It is very very helpfull to train in other arts. Im lucky as every month we have something called a ''masters day'' when loads of diffrent martial arts get together at diffrent venues (ive mentioned these before), we learn from each other, spar against each and trying out the other styles tecniques." - Matt Banks From This Page

    Allright, so, many people mix martial styles. And they dont have to stop to make the change in techniques from second to second. But I think I should cite an expert here. This is an article discussing Bruce Lee's philosophy of martial arts mixing:

    "Perhaps no fighter in modern history has affected hand-to-hand combat more than Bruce Lee. It was he who first began mixing martial arts styles of both the East and the West, always utilizing what he found essential and discarding the rest. He was also the very first who brought Chinese martial arts styles--and the wonders of Asian culture itself--out of its mysterious shroud to make it understandable and accessible to everyone else.

    Though originally trained in the Shaolin fighting style Wing Chun, Bruce Lee began to find its rules restricting, sometimes even futile, in actual combat situations. What worked during practice did not always work when fighting someone of a different style or an unorthodox way of fighting.

    And how, you may ask, did the philosophical Bruce Lee discover this bold fact? While living in America before his film fame, Bruce Lee began doing what was, for many Chinese in martial arts, a definite no-no: he started teaching non-Asians Wing Chun, firmly believing that what matters is who a person is, and not the race of the student--again, he was a man ahead of his time. Other Asian martial arts schools were not pleased, and offered Bruce Lee an ultimatum: Battle and beat one of our best fighters to prove you are a teacher of ability and integrity, or we will make it very tough for you in America.

    Bruce Lee accepted the challenge, and defeated the fighter in a fierce struggle--though it must be noted that while this was covered in Hollywood’s otherwise excellent telling of Lee’s life in the biopic Dragon some 10 years ago, the other fighter in fact did not injure Lee in any way after the match. Lee injured himself later by pushing his body beyond its limits during one grueling workout, severely injuring his own back.

    Lee used his convalescence to re-think his fighting style, and eventually the role of martial arts itself in a modern society. The result was his own fighting ‘style’--if it is proper to call no definite style a ‘style’ at all--which he called ‘Jeet Kune Do’, or the ‘Way of the Intercepting Fist’.

    Jeet Kune Do is not about setting up restrictions or "Ways" of doing things. It has no interest in trying to mold or shape you. It accepts you as you are. Individuals may--and in fact are encouraged to--modify, add and delete the style until they have transcended the need for any "way" or "system" at all--including Jeet Kune Do.

    Bruce Lee's philosophy of personal liberation is that the teacher is, in many ways, a physician rather than a person handing down expired dogma. A physician is always trying to get rid of his patients’ sicknesses, and to send them away healthy enough to stand on their own two feet. Bruce Lee's ultimate objective as a teacher was to get rid of his students so that they wouldn't need him or any other teacher.

    Jeet Kune Do can be viewed as a guide to reach the peak of personal liberation and fighting ability through the study of non-stylized martial arts. You, the individual become, through this process of self-discovery, your own best teacher. What we really need to know about ourselves and how we fight, think, or live should not end when finishing study at any school. Through the practice of Jeet Kune Do, the martial arts trials and tribulations we experience result in a never-ending gain in abilities and self-knowledge.

    We’ll end by letting Bruce Lee explain himself. The following are quotes from an article Lee himself penned entitled, My View on Gung Fu:

    “Some instructors of martial art favor forms, the more complex and fancy the better. [...] To me, the extraordinary aspect of gung fu lies in its simplicity.

    Gung fu is simply the direct expression of one’s feeling with the minimum of movements and energy. [...] The easy way is always the right way, and gung fu is nothing at all special; the closer to the true way of gung fu, the less wastage of expression there is.

    Instead of facing combat in its suchness, quite a few systems of martial art accumulate "fanciness" that distorts and cramps their practitioners and distracts them from the actual reality of combat, which is simple and direct and non-classical. Instead of going immediately to the heart of things, flowery forms and artificial techniques (organized despair!) are ritually practiced to simulate actual combat. Thus, instead of being in combat, these practitioners are idealistically doing something about combat.

    “True gung fu is not daily increase, but daily decrease. Bring wise in gung fu does not mean adding more, but to be able to get on without ornamentation and be simply simple--like a sculptor building a statue, not by adding but by hacking away the unessential so that the truth will be revealed unobstructed.”
    By Cliff Montgomery, ExtremeProSports.com - From This Page

    But I suspect you STILL won't take my word for it. So I suggest talking to Erwin Bayarta (<--SP?) or Leslie Buck or Trey Koch about it via phone or email. All of those fighters have trained in multiple martial arts and can explain how easy it is to transition during fighting from techniques learned in one school to techniques aquired elsewhere without even a split second of hesitation. Please, I ask you to consult these experts and reconsider your ruling. I believe it is not a very realistic rule and the game really doesn't need it. Other than to stop me from doing the aforementioned strategems which isn't a good enough reason for so antithetical a rule to prevail.
    "Daggra" means "Enemy" in Tibetan.
    "Chora" means "Thief" in Sanskrit.

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Ghorüm ().

  • Help me out here, People!

    Will some other current or former martial artists PLEASE chime in on this. I KNOW that I can't be the only one who believes in mixing martial arts training! As another example, I have NEVER met a capoiera practitioner who didn't cross train in a more street-effective martial art like Jeet Kun Do or Tae Kwon Do or Brazilian Ju Juitsu.
    "Daggra" means "Enemy" in Tibetan.
    "Chora" means "Thief" in Sanskrit.
  • Ya know, after further thought, Bruce used his experience of several styles to develope the style he called Jeet Kun Do (sp?) with some philosiphy about "being like water" ('If you put water in a glass, it becomes the glass. If you put water on the floor, it becomes a puddle',,, or something along those lines)

    Eric, you've come up with a lot of martial styles, why not come up with a style that allows the deciple to draw from the knowledge of other styles s(he) possesses and use them in conjunction w/ each other, while maintaining some sort of "mechanical integrity" for purposes of game balance?

    On a side not to this end, I think it would be an exclusively "Tishinian" Style developed where many cultures mingle allowing for such a style to be created, and much like the work of Bruce, many, most, or even all other styles would frown upon it's useage, especially in situations like spiral arena combat. Of course, folks like the Yadru, or the Sustramise Military would prize it for it's effectiveness.\

    As for me, I'll just stick to bandoleers of Valah pistols.
    I'd rather kiss Satha Vortoc on his sything death-hole
  • Well,..here's the long and the short of it:

    1. You CAN mix martial styles together in a combat,..but on a round to round basis NOT on a maneuver to maneuver basis.

    The rules MUST work that way, considering the fact that, at the beginning of each combat round in which you use your Martial Arts, you pick the Style you'll be using so that you can use its value to determine the number of dice you will roll to generate the number of Actions you get. Rounds are only six seconds long, so think of it as being able to switch Martial Styles entirely every six seconds. It needs to be this way because the numeric values (dice pools) can vary from Style to Style.

    2. When martial artists get together (on Dardunah at least) and decide they really like the various maneuvers from different styles, and wish to combine them effectively together, they take those various maneuvers and create a NEW style out of them.

    There are several Martial Styles in the current rules iteration that serve as evidence of this. Many of the Lineal Styles, in fact, share maneuvers with one another, or are a result of the combination of maneuvers from other styles. The idea, though, is that this is not an "ad hoc" or "off the cuff" process that effectively happens in the middle of combat ("Hey look, guys,..I just made a whole new wacky style during the last six seconds of the melee round I was just in,.. out of bits and pieces of these other styles I know,...I call it Frankenstein's Ass Style... Innit COOL?!?!").

    The process, instead, should be the result of study, practice, and training, so that the fluid movements and other elements utilized in the disparate maneuvers can eventually be melded into a single Martial Style that is well balanced and functions smoothly in theory. The result of this would be a totally new Martial Style in Dardunah!! THAT's the idea behind how all those "Mixed" Lineal and Temple Styles came about. (For the sake of rules balance,..it would then be reviewed and altered by me as need be.)

    In most movies I've seen where these guys are dishing out several Styles in the same fight (and sometimes yelling the names of their maneuvers out as they're doing it), their run of a particular Style seems to last many seconds before they "switch" to some other Style. Consider that a combat round,..which is how long in the Dardunah rules you must use a Style for before you can switch...

    Scottie ^^
  • Ok so yeah, it's not like Bruce just decided one day that he was gonna mix all his martial diciplines into a new style and within 6 seconds he had it all worked out into Jeet Kun Do.

    Thanks for the long & short of it, I didn't think there was really no other reason for not mixing styles than just to limit potential for "unstoppable force".

    I like my idea for the concept of a "forbidden" style, Eric would you care to help me with the mechanics to develope it?
    I'd rather kiss Satha Vortoc on his sything death-hole